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High sec Mission runners just got completely screwed by CCP

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 7 post(s)
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 5096	Posted - 2014.03.20 19:17:00 - [1] - Quote Dinsdale Pirannha wrote: Folks, read the newest dev blog. The goons in the post are gloating in their posts, so you know it is terrible for high sec. In a few months, mission runners will now have to invest weeks and weeks of training, plus buy a hideously expensive implant, to get the privilege of a 27.6% nerf to all mission loot refines. Man, you are like clockwork lol.
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 5097	Posted - 2014.03.20 21:08:00 - [2] - Quote Xeronikus wrote: baltec1 wrote: CCP need to make null worth fighting for first. I don't know but it appears to me you guys are fighting for your space in null quite extensively. Or are you telling me you're just doing it out of pity for the poor null space and actually need to run high-sec missions to pay for your expenses in null? As has been said, lots of null players have high sec alts becuase of how unbalanced high sec is (and will still be after these changes). And don't mistake the 'Boredom Wars' for 'null is worth fighting for'. The only thing coaltions get out of these wars now is space to rent to high sec groups too young/small to take space for themselves. You can see this by how alliances take a few systems for their members to rat/mine in (knowing they don't need more than that because many of those members will be doing high sec missions/incursions, FW, NPC null missions or wormhole stuff to make isk) and put the rest up for renting. I was dissapointed after the ESS thing (thankfully my hopes came to fruition and damn near no one uses the thing), but this change is at least a step in the right general direction.
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 5099	Posted - 2014.03.21 03:38:00 - [3] - Quote Lady Areola Fappington wrote: James Amril-Kesh wrote: And they're not nullsec devs. They're devs. Never really got the whole "Goonspiracy" thing, on how goons somehow "control" CCP. It's weird cognitive dissonance. On one hand, our local conspiracy buffs will tell us that goons have so much powers over CCP, because with a snap of the finger, Mittens can force all goons to quit Eve, which would cost CCP all their revenue.... Yet, on the other side, CCP should never ever make changes to highsec, because the vast majority of players live in highsec and changes that benefit null are worthless to most players etc. I mean, which is it? Both http://www.livescience.com/18171-contradicting-conspiracy-theories-mistrust.html
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 5100	Posted - 2014.03.21 13:58:00 - [4] - Quote Dinsdale hypocrisy, best hypocrisy. When we were discussing the 5% nerf that came bundled with the disastrous ESS thing, what did you (and very many other high sec zealots) say about that I wonder? Oh yea, I remember now, it was "CCP has the numbers", meaning that CCPs has access to the data that shows them that null (and only null) bounties needed that 5% nerf. So Dinsdale, did CCP suddenly , magically lose those same numbers whenever it comes to balancing things that affect high sec?
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 5101	Posted - 2014.03.21 15:05:00 - [5] - Quote MatrixSkye Mk2 wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Doing missions wrong isn't a playstyle. Not that I disagree with the changes; in fact, I think they'll end up doing good in the long run, but your comment above is just baseless rhetoric. Because a mission runner chooses to loot his missions and bypass 'blitzing' does not mean he's mission running wrong. It does if his goal is to make the most isk in the least amount of time. If his goal is to build stuff, or gain standings for other reasons, or just for fun because he likes to see what kind of loot he can get out of mission wrecks, then clearing and salvaging/looting are fine. If he's running missions for isk, intentionally lowering his isk/hr is the exact opposite of what he should be doing, better known as 'doing it wrong'. It's not just missions, people do that across the board. I had a buddy I used to run anomalies and complexes with a few years ago. I'd chain anoms as fast as i could, for the isk from bounties but also because each site has a chance to escalate of produce a commander spawn. He'd do a couple, come back, loot and salvage with the same character, the reship and do some more. We were both doing anoms to fund our pvp, he struggled to keep up with his loses, I didn't because I'd get escalation and though most of those sites didn't drop much, every once in a while you get a super drop (3+ bil one time from a DED 6/10). At the end of the day i spent less time having to do PVe and more time shooting at real people. He wasn't committing a crime doing things the way he was, he was just picking a sub-optimal way of doing it. Sub-Optimal way of doing things, aka "doing it wrong" lol.
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 5102	Posted - 2014.03.21 18:17:00 - [6] - Quote Vaerah Vahrokha wrote: Also, my "narrative" comes from the point of view of someone who has done everything in EvE except reactions (never found them fun or highly profitable enough) and now is sort of "pensioneer" with no active interest in EvE any more except trading. That is, all these changes are fairly neutral to me, I don't have anything to GAIN saying A instead of B. Where I am not neutral is, I have had terrible past MMO experiences when the developers started catering to only a portion of the player base, that is the loudest and most established. They invariably tanked over time, as new players would find themselves hit by a "wealth divide" that prevented them from growing "powerful" at a good rate like the others could. Considering EvE has become great without wealth divides, I don't like the idea of seeing what happens when they get implemented. EVE has had a wealth divide since day 2, and that divide is very stark now compared to the past. EVE succeeds IMO because it doesn't attract MMO players who care about such things and relative wealth, 'leveling' and being able to 'catch up'. It repels traditional MMO players for the most part and thank the Icelandic Gods for that. CCP isn't catering to anyone, they are making good faith changes they believe (rightly or not) will make the game better. If they were 'catering' to people (such as null sec), the forsaken hub nerf, the ESS, the systems upgrades nerf, the NPC AI changes, the warp speed changes and the old DED plex nerfs would have never ever happened. All those nerfs heavily affected null sec which ccp didn't intend but that just how it shook out.
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 5102	Posted - 2014.03.21 18:20:00 - [7] - Quote Anabella Rella wrote: baltec1 wrote: The best part of all of this is that the best income levels from missions involve no looting at all. So everyone should just blitz and not even think about looting/salvaging? Not all of us who run missions are min/maxers looking for the absolute best isk per hour. I don't fly a ridiculously expensive mission ship. I don't have a specially implanted clone for PVE. I do missions as a way to make income, yes but, I also do them as a way to add a little variety to my game play. By your logic CCP should just remove all the loot/salvage drops from missions. Oh, and remove Marauders as well since they'd serve no real purpose anymore. That leap of logic is too far. Baltec never said anything about taking away loot. He said that the best income come from blitzing. Since you don't care about the best isk/hr, what he said has nothing to do with you.
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 5104	Posted - 2014.03.21 19:17:00 - [8] - Quote Lucas Kell wrote: That means the total mission loot is nerfed by 14.3-10.4 = 3.9%. And yet the 5% nerf to null bounties (and only null bounties) was "nothing to complain about" according to the poster you replied to be "CCP has the numbers and knows what needs to be done" lol. So much faith he has in CCP until it's some part of high sec getting rebalanced lol.
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 5119	Posted - 2014.03.22 20:22:00 - [9] - Quote Tippia wrote: You were disrespectful, bickering, uncivilised, dismissive, and did not in any way invite any kind of respectful treatment since you spat at any attempt at doing so. After a few rounds of this, the gloves came off and you only have yourself to blame so don't even try to point your finger at others. You should read the above again Salvos. As I read this thread, you started the uncivil ball rolling. You didn't deal with being incorrect properly (ie you were too bound by your opinion to allow for the fact that it could be wrong) and kept doubling down, being mad at the people who were demonstrating correct points is childish. The important thing is the truth, not wheter of not people are nice to you or not when telling you the truth.
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 5119	Posted - 2014.03.22 20:24:00 - [10] - Quote Lucas Kell wrote: Vaerah Vahrokha wrote: Lucas Kell wrote: This is a good and needed change for the whole game. If you want to plonk on your tinfoil hat and claim that the entire universe will collapse due to these changes be my guest. For a supposed expert in speculation you seem to be taking what is a small change and blowing it up into some huge thing. The change is good per se but it is "directed" to benefit the most a target which is not the most deserving. All the rest you type is a reflection of what you want to read in my words. How is it? Let's be clear, who is this target that is not the most deserving? And who would you say is the most deserving? You can't really argue with a prejudiced person and the person you are replying to is extremely prejudiced against null sec players.
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 5120	Posted - 2014.03.22 20:41:00 - [11] - Quote Mario Putzo wrote: Lots of petty personal attacks going on here, and we were finding out so much to. I wonder what CCP thinks about swapping LS and NS moon and roid minerals around. Since LS is the one getting shaft again. Forces more null players to use their space. Gives more income generation to LS where it is needed. This is why prejudice is bad. You obvioulsy don't understand how things work or how people react. Swapping Ls and NS moons simply mean null allainces invade low sec even more than they do now. My very 1st fight as a member of a Raiden Alliance corp was a fight over a low sec moon (got on 72 kill mails my 1st day in raiden, 13 final kills and 4 solo kills inculded in that total). Do you think some magical wall exists that will keep null from taking the low sec moons? Swapping the moons simply means people like me because your new low sec overlords, which you for one should welcome (lol). And you can't "force" anyone to do anything. Time and time again it's been demonstrated that if you nerf null, people just adapt with alts, which is why many of us have high sec, faction warfare and wormhole isk making alts. Every change CCP has made to try to get people to "use" sov null resulted in an alt exodus (like the anom nerf that had the result of making high sec incursion wait lists longer lol).
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 5128	Posted - 2014.03.23 18:06:00 - [12] - Quote Salvos Rhoska wrote: Lucas Kell wrote: YES, null industry will be buffed, but NO null industry will not be buffed to the point of being competitive with high sec. Salvos Rhoska wrote: Beneficiaries of the change are: -Null entities capable of financing the refinery efficiency installations -Null sec entitites with renters who now have some degree of added incentive to mine, refine and provide resources to null domestically. -Those renters, to some degree, depending on how sov owners adjust their rent, access to facilities, protection and possivle incenrive programs to ensure a greater flow of minerals from null domestically. -POS owners with compression capability throughout the universe. -Null sec entitites with the infrastructure to manufacture and sell products both to high sec markets, and also some null markets. Those who stand to lose from the changes are:: -Reprossecors. -Mission/rat/plex runners -Entities currently dependant on what mission/rat/plex runners bring in. -High sec industrialists who now have to compete with null industrialists who have a wider margin owing to the better refinement efficiency in their native space -Miners without personal access to advanced refining facilities, in high sec as their raw output will be suppressed by the margins of compression services, in null sec because you will have to pay for the privilege as rent, which suppresses your profits. @Ramona McCandless: It was sarcasm. I'm not very good at these dishonest games that Lucas and Tippia play. I prefer saying what I mean and meaning what I say. That's a cop out, they arne't being dishonest, they are telling you the truth as they see it and yo are too emotionally invovled to understand that. I serioulsy dislike seeing people have the "you must be trolling me" reaction when people disagree with them. It means that in your mind you think you are important enough for someone to lie to you, when in fact you are not (none of us are).
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 5131	Posted - 2014.03.24 16:32:00 - [13] - Quote Malcanis wrote: Salvos Rhoska wrote: By means of example: Tippia, I lay claim to represent your interests. According to your logic, you have no means to disprove that, because you claim that your vote for me is not necessary in order for me to claim to represent your interests. You fail to understand both the mechanics of elective representation, as well as the scientific process of constructing and defining a sample grouping that is proportinately an accurate representation of the whole. Both of which are sepaeate from each other and peform functions completely extraneous to each other. Even a basic understanding of political science, as well as a high school understanding of the scientific process avails a person to differentiate on and discuss these matters. Anyone I have not voted for, has no claim to represent me. Au contraire, I have an excellent claim to represent you to CCP: I have been elected by due process to the CSM, and that claim is backed up by CCP themselves. Whether you like it or not, they do consult me and the other 13 CSMs with respect to your interests, and believe it or not we represent you to the best of our ability and according to our beliefs and principles. My claim to be your representative on the CSM (player advisory council to CCP) isn't a matter of opinion or debate: it's the simple truth. I am. Your consent or agreement is not required. Furthermore, you're going to be represented whether you wish to be or not. Don't like that? Oh, that's too bad So you have some options in front of you: 1) Continue sulking and whining and denying the plain facts of the situation, essentially keeping the status quo ante forever. AKA the "Cry more" option. 2) Drop the baseless ad hominems and Big Lie bullshit and engage with the people who are actually working on your behalf. AKA the "Deal with it" option. 3) Organise you and the people who agree with you, and start making yourself known and start giving other people enough reasons to trust you enough to vote for you that you get elected so you can do a much better job than horrible sellout null RMT bloc whores like me/ AKA the "Do something about it" option. So tl;dr: Cry more, deal with it, or do something about it - it's your call. They choose option D: Do option A but pretend like they are doing options B and C
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 5133	Posted - 2014.03.24 16:46:00 - [14] - Quote Herzog Wolfhammer wrote: Democracy is a form of collectivism. Show me where in human history this form of collectivism actually had a good outcome? With voting, everybody has to live in fear of what someone else thinks. It's called "civilization" and because civilization must be organized to function, that means that as an individual you don't always get your way.. You are using a product of civilization right now (the device you used to post that, which also allows you to play a game that would not exists without organizaed civilization also). I marvel at the double standards of anarchists types who at the very same time are enjoying the fruits of the organized society they despise. Sane people know that anything above minimal collectivism is a bad thing, but the thing that is worst than that is NO organization at all. Ask Somalia about how great anarchy is. Quote: Pick the worst of the worst imbeciles you ever met, or the blackest of the blackest little souls, and know that they can vote for "representatives" who pass laws and those laws are enforced at the barrel of a gun. In the game, thankfully, the "laws" are enforced at the barrel of mechanics. Spoken like a true felon lol. When I don't like the laws I campaign against them (effectively, the City council and school board in my city know me by name) as opposed to the people who seem to think "screw it, I can't win so why even try". Quote: Do you, leet nullsec PVPers, want to live under any "laws" voted for by people who think non-consensual PVP should be removed from the game? Do you, highsec carebear, want to be subject to the opinions of people so hooked up on their stats that every other topic to come out of them is all about how CCP should funnel everybody into their gate camp? The only votes that ever mattered, to this game and in RL, are the votes you cast with your feet and with your wallet. Those are the only votes that matter. Ever. (there is a "third" vote, cast with bullets - that only happens in RL and it's only after they've taken your money and got you cornered) I always tell people to vote with their actions, AS WELL AS their votes. Voting doesn't guaruntee positive results (which is why a lot of people don't vote, because "my vote doesn't mean anything" which is stupid), it demonstrates that you had your say by the agreed upon rules. As an IRL example, voting (as a form of action) is the difference between an effective political movement that many people disagree with but that was still able to get some people elected at least in the short term (Tea Party) and an ineffective poltical movement that went down in history as an impotent, disorganized and futile joke (Occupy).
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 5133	Posted - 2014.03.24 16:52:00 - [15] - Quote Nick Bete wrote: Don't waste your time talking to the omnipotent and omniscient Malcanis. It's his world and we are just peasants renting space in it. Again, I call for all who are unhappy with these changes to VOTE WITH YOUR WALLETS. Don't try engaging the phony CSM with your grievances. TAKE REAL ACTION THAT CCP WILL NOTICE. UNSUBSCRIBE. Only through declining player numbers and revenues will CCP ever take your concerns seriously. A perfect example of what malcanis was talking about lol. Malcanis didn't make you a powerless peasant, you did. What always amazes me is how people can get so caught up in a game that they actually advocate people stop having fun over some fringe issue that isn't the end of the world, hell it isn't even the end of a virtual world. Freaking ingrates, you are basically saying "lets economically hurt the game that has given all of us thousands upon thousands of hours of enjoyment and pinch the actual real world wallets of the great human being who brought us the game (and use the money they make bringing us this wonderful experience to feed their families) because they changed a variable in a database they own and now we're made!!!!!". On behalf or actual decent people (including the fine folks at CCP), I say "screw you" to anyone who thinks like this.
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 5133	Posted - 2014.03.24 16:54:00 - [16] - Quote Salvos Rhoska wrote: He can sit on the council and claim "I represent Salvos Rhoska" all he wants. Just as I can sit at a bar and proudly exclaim I represent every one in EVE, including Malcanis. Neither will be true. While you are sitting in that bar, please provide a list of all the people who voted for you to be there representing EVE....you know, like Malcanis can because thousands of us voted for him. That kind fo sums up your whole posting history lol, other people have reason and logic on their side and you have....the ability to type words that are lies.
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 5138	Posted - 2014.03.24 16:56:00 - [17] - Quote Weaselior wrote: Malcanis wrote: Au contraire, I have an excellent claim to represent you to CCP: I have been elected by due process to the CSM, and that claim is backed up by CCP themselves. Whether you like it or not, they do consult me and the other 13 CSMs with respect to your interests, and believe it or not we represent you to the best of our ability and according to our beliefs and principles. My claim to be your representative on the CSM (player advisory council to CCP) isn't a matter of opinion or debate: it's the simple truth. I am. Your consent or agreement is not required. I voted for Malcanis specifically because of his unwillingness to suffer fools and every time I see fools complaining that he is not suffering them, I know I voted well. +1. I spit soda when i read this. This makes you a bad person because it made me do something in real life
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 5140	Posted - 2014.03.24 17:13:00 - [18] - Quote Salvos Rhoska wrote: Why are so many of you angered by this? He can claim he represents me all he wants. And even believe it, if he wants. Doesn't change that I have not signed a paper anywhere empowering, mandating or consenting to him representing me. To me, he's just some guy who got votes from a small population of the game and gets to chat with CCP. Do I care? No lol. Does he represent me? No. Because your behavior is reprehensible and your views are incorrect.
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 5144	Posted - 2014.03.24 17:18:00 - [19] - Quote Nick Bete wrote: Jenn aSide wrote: ...A bunch of insults and spurious arguments... I'm simply taking action and urging others to do the same as is my right. Good to see how you null bigots and big alliance shills feel on open display for all to see. You just can't stand anyone with a differing opinion can you? Hypocrite. I wasn't making any commnet about null. I was commenting about how idiotic it is to suggest to people that they hurt the real life people who make EVE and the entire EVe community because CCP makes a change to the game that isn't in any way any kind of big deal. I've seen real people lose real money in the stock market, or lose their jobs unfairly, or get hurt due to a criminal act who didn't respond as childishly as you are to CCP swapping a few 1s and 0s in a game they own and produce. Recently CCP introduced an item (the ESS) that nerfed my null income by 5%. I posted that I thought it was a bad idea and....that's all. I didn't bat phone Alliance leaders demanding they encourage their 90,000 members to unsub lol. Why didn't I? Because I'm an adult who can keep a video game in context. Don't get mad at me because you can't son.
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 5144	Posted - 2014.03.24 17:20:00 - [20] - Quote Salvos Rhoska wrote: Jenn aSide wrote: Because your behavior is reprehensible and your views are incorrect. Deal with it. Not that any of that is true in the first place. Take a chill pill. Your anger levels are not healthy, or justified. Who said i was angry. I was explaining to you how your own actions created the results you were questioning. You don't seem to be able to take resonjsibility for yourself or your actions, which I find sad...but amusing lol. Thank you for creating forum content, you General Discussion Emergent gameplayer you
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 5144	Posted - 2014.03.24 17:25:00 - [21] - Quote This is why Malcanis should run for CSM 9. I say we all go picket on Malc's street to he gives in and runs. Without him, who will generate such....love.... from the less mentally stable among us?
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 5591	Posted - 2014.03.28 13:27:00 - [22] - Quote I'm a high sec mission runner and i don't feel screwed by this change. I do feel screwed by this thread though. Less conspiracy, more cowbell I always say.
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 6168	Posted - 2014.04.24 12:17:00 - [23] - Quote Dinsdale Pirannha wrote: Lucas Kell wrote: "Done correctly" missions are 100% safe. If you get ganked, you didn't do them correctly. Anyway, we're talking about a 3.7% decrease in income, which is nowt compared to the increase in income given by the introduction of MTUs, and less than the null bounty nerf. Considering the upside is fixing and incredibly broken system that holds back development of changes and lead to the introduction of "extra"" minerals on ships, I'd say it's a pretty worthwhile change. But as with literally any change they make, people will still complain right up until it gets put in, then their complaints will die down when the realise the world didn't end. You are a liar. Plain and simple, you are a liar. Losing mission loot is way way way more than 3.7% of total mission payouts. I have run enough missions to know that statement of yours is a complete lie. CCP knows it to, but won't put out the data because they know what the backlash will be. Have you run enough missions yet to understand that NOS is an engineering mod and not EWAR like you thought it was a week ago? Given your demonstrate lack of PVE knowledge I don't see why you think you are an authority on any of it.
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 6170	Posted - 2014.04.24 12:51:00 - [24] - Quote Dinsdale Pirannha wrote: Dave Stark wrote: wrote: Jenn aSide I don't see why you think you are an authority on any of it. probably because if you spend a weekend doing missions the chance you'll have seen every possible mission (multiple times) is practically 1. Pretty much this. I guess I have only run, oh I dunno, likely 10,000 missions in almost 6 years. Let's see, I have the following corp standings: 10.00 with one corp 9.99 with 2 corps better than 9.0 with 10 other corps But yeah, I know nothing about missions. I ran a bunch with one last week to get above 6.67 Pulled out over 50M in meta 3 or lower loot in 2 days. If that was this 3.7% of my total payout, that means i picked up 1.35 billion in mission payout. Given I ran less than 16 missions (I only had one storyline), that means the average mission was worth in excess of 80 milllion ISK, which of course, it was not. OMFG lol, so you're bad a math too? I thought Canada had a good school system.....
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 6178	Posted - 2014.04.24 15:23:00 - [25] - Quote admiral root wrote: Dinsdale, given how much you seem to hate Eve, CCP, imaginary cartels, etc, I've got to ask - why are you still here? If I disliked a game that much I'd simply quit. That would seem the ...sane... response :) . But at the risk of doing some internet psycologizing (lol), i think that some people just need an enemy to rail against, in games and in real life. Without that all powerful 'other' messing everything up, how will people like that measure themselves? And some people just need to see things 'change' no matter if that change is needed or not. The funny thing is that if things do change like they say thiey want, the quickly get bored with the situation and more on to 'fix' something else that needs changing. As it is with the Dinsdales of EVE, it is with the ex-girlfriends of real life I'm like you, if I just needed a space game but couldn't stand all the things that poster routinely complains about I'd be playing Star Trek Online, a game that takes a harsh stand against 'griefers' and has no non-consensual anything at all (I do play STO part time still, it's not a bad game and and i hate for my Klingon Lt. General to go to waste lol).
Jenn aSide Smokin Aces. 6424	Posted - 2014.05.12 17:49:00 - [26] - Quote BoBoZoBo wrote: This only impacts people who use their time ineffectively, then blame others for nerfing their ability to get ahead in life. You just described at least 50% of humanity.

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